The West Memphis Three (Satanic Panic IV)

In a shocking case that captured the attention of the nation, the West Memphis Three were sent to jail for a crime they.. didn't commit. The final part of our Satanic Panic series.

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Marissa: 0:00

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Matthew: 0:10

West Memphis Arkansas may 5 1993 at 6:30pm Terry Hobbs, the stepfather of eight year old Stevie branch, was seen yelling for Stevie and his two friends to go home by 7pm. That same night, Mark Byers called the police to report that his eight year old son Christopher Byers hadn't come home. The three young friends would disappear that night. On May 6 1993, the bodies of the three boys were found naked, beaten and hogtied with their own shoelaces. The bodies had been dumped in a creek bed, Stevie branch and Michael Moore showed signs of being beaten, but were found to have died from drowning. The third Christopher Byers had died from his injuries, which included possible bite marks laceration, blunt trauma, and a D skinning of his genitals. The list of suspects would range from a local ice cream truck driver, a blood covered man and a local fast food restaurant. And the children's parents themselves all before resting heavily on three teenage boys who are accused of committing the crime as part of a satanic ritual. Join us as we add another entry into this our Macabrepedia

Marissa: 1:41

Hello, and welcome to Macabrepedia a marriage of true crime and the truly bizarre we are your hosts Marissa and Matthew. And that sounds really terrible. And sounds like we are continuing our Satanic Panic series.

Matthew: 1:55

Yeah, really terrible is kind of what we do here at Macabrepedia. But there's levels Yeah, well, this is this is a crime that does involve some children violence. And I think we're gonna have to take a break from children violence for a while I think so. But yeah, it's that is that that I get? I mean, a lot of the a lot of crimes that involve children get a lot of attention, right. I mean, cuz they're

Marissa: 2:30

because of how dark and terrible they're Yeah.

Matthew: 2:33

Yeah, for sure. In this, this particular crime, this is known as the West Memphis Three, the West Memphis Three are actually the perpetrators or the alleged perpetrators. To the crime. That would be Jessie Misskelley. Damien Echols and James Baldwin, three teenage boys who were connected to very loosely, very loosely connected by very loosely. I mean, literally, no evidence to connect them to the murder of three eight year old boys, Stevie branch, Michael Moore, and Christopher Byers.

Marissa: 3:19

Okay, so explain to me why they were involved with this.

Matthew: 3:23

Well, because it's a small town, and it's a Christian God fearing kind of town. So the behaviors of some of these youthful rapscallions the these these three teenagers started to get some attention, particularly like the leader of their little band, their little group, Damien Echols, was known for being into the occult he had recently prior to this, this crime. He had been in a mental hospital. This is all stuff that would come out during their trial more so than anything else. The what actually gets them kind of linked to it. I don't really know I don't know the spark that got them. pinpointed as as the culprits. There's there's nothing there. Eventually, what would happen is Jesse Miss Kelly would give a confession to the crime. This,

Marissa: 4:32

that'll link you to it.

Matthew: 4:33

Yes. But Jesse is no was he? He had an IQ reportedly of 70 to 72. So pretty low. He eventually was brought in by police and interrogated for 12 hours. Only, like 40 ish minutes of it was actually recorded and even in this 40 ish minute Long recorded confession. You can still hear the direction and the leading of the suspect from the from the police or from the interrogator,

Marissa: 5:10

who did this last week and stuff last week to just very much leading. Oh, yeah.

Matthew: 5:16

Well, I mean, if you if you have a hypothesis

Marissa: 5:20

as Yeah, you want to get that? You don't want to get to that?

Matthew: 5:23

Yeah. So you kind of, you know, you can't, but you kind of push the story a little bit, but you're not supposed to

Marissa: 5:30

know. I mean, I get it, but it's not effective. And it can lead to somebody confessing to something that they didn't do,

Matthew: 5:36

right. And in this case, Jesse would admit guilt in the crime, as well as he would implicate the other two boys in this crime as well. And in the confession, he would, you can tell that he's being led a bit because even the timeframe in which it happens, is being being led by the by the interrogator, which Miss Kelly eventually, or initially says that he implies without actually saying that it's that it's earlier in the afternoon when this happens. And then the investigator would ask something along the lines of like, so after school, and he would say, Yes, after school, right. Yeah. And then he would say, the interrogator would say, Well, what happened that night? So now it went from sometime in the afternoon, to after school to now at night, which he never said that it was at night and the way that he seems to be delivering this. Is that it? He's He's guessing. Right? And you can, and this is, again, 12 hours of interrogation for a 40 minute confession conversation, definitely makes it seem like there is quite a bit left out there. And they would later say that this was the he had knowledge of the crime that he couldn't have known any other way. Only could if you lead him that way. And you gave them that information. You ask those right questions, and you have nothing to record, no recording showing where you did that part. You know, there's some questions to be had there. The police were then there, there was also, according to some sources, there were police that had heard that other people had had overheard, Damien Echols, claiming that he had done this crime, and that the police had then tried to bug an area like bug a house and then have the three boys go to this to this house. And they tried to get this this person who had made this claim, try to weasel out a confession from them, which never happened. Now, the police say, according to the sources, that it was inaudible. So you couldn't tell what they were saying. Another person who was who was the person who was trying to get the confession out of them said that nothing was actually said, but it was enough that she, she did testify against them, at some point. So did her she didn't do anything. No, no, she testified against against them that she did here. And there was a lot of people who testified. Not a lot, but there are people who testified against them. Say, Oh, I heard Damien, telling somebody that he killed those boys. And the defense said, Okay, what did he say right before that? And they're like, oh, no, what do you say right after that?

Marissa: 8:46

I don't know. So you just happen to walk in right at the right moment. And confess to that, yeah, that

Matthew: 8:51

exact moment, you heard that the two sentences where he was just happened to be bragging at a baseball or whatever, I think was a sporting event, bragging about this, and you happen to overhear, and these are like other kids that are that are on track or that are testifying against them. So and this is gonna be seen in an HBO documentary called Paradise Lost. It's a three part documentary that takes place over like 20 years, because it follows her whole story. So the after this, the boys go missing. So we're backing up a little bit after the boys go missing. So we're back at like may 5, the night of May 5 into May 6. There is a search party that goes out and starts to look for the boys and this is a pretty intensive search party pulling in you know, volunteers from around the area as well as police and everything. And they're doing this this search. And while they're during the A search Terry Hobbs, which is Stevie branch's stepfather, he, he has he comes home and then says that he's going to go get his friend David Jacoby Hobbs goes to Jacoby's house, where they hang out and play guitar together for a while, meanwhile, has steps on is missing. Yeah. And there's a search happening. Then at some point. Terry Hobbs says, I think it's time to go ahead and go help with the search. You think Yeah. So he while flip that he did he then he then leaves Jacoby to go change his clothes to go off to the search party. Nobody in the search ever says that Terry ever shows up. Which is a little unusual, for sure. They would also later, much later there would be stories, saying that Terry had cleaned around the time of the crime he had cleaned Stevie's room, taking all the bed linens off and washing them even washed their curtains and stuff like that. Well, this guy did it some pretty unusual labor. Now, this is never a suspect. He's never wrong. Well, there are people who speculate that it was Terry Hobbs. That's, that is it is a possibility?

Marissa: 11:31

Well, it definitely seems suspicious. Well, he did that.

Matthew: 11:34

Yeah. So there are some things that point to Terry as being a possible possible suspect he's never tried as a suspect. There are, like I said, there's there's a number of suspects. And another one of the fathers, who is Mark Byers, the adopted father of Christopher Byers, he is kind of put on as a suspect. After the bodies were found, one of the things that were found a marking that was found on them was a belt buckle mark from getting hit with a belt buckle. It was known that that he had that he had spanked Christopher with a belt prior to him going out that night. So there is also some stuff that leads towards him later, and more information would come out that would also kind of link him to, to a possible something suspicious, was that in this was never brought up in the initial trial, I don't believe but in, which happens in 1994. And like 9096 9710, or I'm sorry, Mark Byers would get all of his teeth removed. After there was speculation that Christopher Byers, I believe was Christopher Morris had bite marks on him. And suddenly Mark gets all of his teeth taken out. He would claim that it was because he takes seizure medicines that were causing tooth decay, as well as he's known that a lot of these people seem very much into drug and alcohol abuse,

Marissa: 13:24

which does affect your teeth, right.

Matthew: 13:26

So there and he said that he had chronic issues with his teeth, he got them all removed and got dentures. Well the timing does seem a little suspicious, though it is a little suspicious that right before they started taking molds of the West Memphis Three teeth to try to compare it to this. Somebody else goes and gets his teeth taken out. Also, another thing that links him to it was during the filming of the documentary for HBO Paradise Lost, he gave one of the cameramen a knife, like a hunting knife. And the cameraman for reasons I'm not exactly sure how it all came out, found that there was possible blood or human tissue or tissue on on the on the knife, which Mr. Byers said had never been used. The HBO producers were like you bring that you bring that right back now, you know, like you do. You do need to know that that is evidence so that it is tested. It turns out that there is blood. They bring this up to Mr. Byers during a questioning during the trials. And he says that is venison from when he was carving

Marissa: 14:52

up a deer. Did they have enough to test to see if it was human tissue

Matthew: 14:55

they did? And then they said well, that's all fine and good. You said they'd never been used now. You're saying you cleaned a deer with it? And it turns out, and he's like, Well, I used it once. And he says, well, it's blood human blood and says, Well, maybe I cut myself when I was doing it. And he says, well, it matches yours and Christopher's blood type. Now, this isn't like a strict DNA testing, where they can show the all of the stuff of the DNA, but they can tell that it's the same type of blood. And they happen to they're not biologically related. But they do share a same blood type. Right? So a little bit weird. He said, Well, maybe he caught himself with it, and may have left it open. And that kind of just just goes on by,

Marissa: 15:43

and nobody follows up on that.

Matthew: 15:47

No, not Not really. It's, so I'm telling you, it's really weird how some how some of the stuff is, there is also in the same at the same time. There's, on May 5 1993, at about eight. It's specifically so 8:42pm. But we'll say around around that time, the night that the boys go missing. There, a man comes into a Bojangles, which for those who are not in an area where there's Bojangles, it's a Kentucky Fried Chicken kind of fried chicken place. local fast food restaurant, a man comes in, he's wearing a sling around his arm. And he goes into the bathroom, where he apparently is bleeding or cleaning up blood or something. They go in and they check on him. And he's just like sitting in a stall like bleeding. They call the police. The man leaves. The police come there. Nobody thinks that this is connected, because it's a little bit further away from the crime scene still in the area. It's just like a, like a jurisdiction or not a jurisdiction but a whatever their area of influence so easily drivable? Oh, yeah. And they, so they take blood samples from this location, the police do, and conveniently lose it. And they're like, wow, wow, while the investigator is on trial, or are being questioned by the defense, he says, Well, what happened to the blood samples that were supposed to be tested? What what what did what did they find? He says, Oh, I lost the I lost the samples. And he's like, you lost the samples? He's like, yep. Because I just don't know what happened to him. Now, this is a pretty small town that doesn't have like these, like state of the art. This isn't bones, you know, by bones. I mean, the teacher, this isn't like, where they're dealing with all this high tech stuff. I mean, they're, they're keeping evidence in like grocery bags from the local grocery stores and stuff like that, like this is not, this is not a really, they are not prepared to deal with a adolescent triple homicide in this area. So that that was another suspect. There was also a couple of suspects, who had at least passingly known the three boys, one of which had been, had been arrested for moving drugs in and he had also run an ice cream truck through the neighborhood. And so he was a little bit of a suspect for a moment, pretty much gone off almost immediately. So let's go back to Jessie Miss Kelly's confession. Yeah. This is the main thing that gets them. He goes, he spends the day getting hurt, you know, pressured by police to give this this confession. And he gives a confession. It's seems very much leading. He said he makes all kinds of claims about them all taking turns, sodomizing the kids and all this stuff and and it's the basically, he confesses to everything. And it's, it seems very much like if the police ask if it happened, he's like, Yes, yesterday and yeah, and all this. So he's he just he just gives it all out there. He then recants the confession at a later date. He ends up because of this confession. He ends up getting tried separately from the other two, because he because there's there's there's laws against confessions that also implicate other people as well as themselves and whatever, so that he gets tried by himself as found guilty and gets a life First sentence, the other two, James Baldwin and Damien Echols, which Damien actually he chose his name to be Damien because he's into a cult stuff. He's got like, you know, the black very black hair and stuff like that and he's practices Wicca and he's very much into this kind of spirituality occultism. He uses enigmas and ciphers that are from arcane, like Aleister Crowley kind of workbooks and stuff like that. And he's very much in magic and all that.

Marissa: 20:40

Yeah. And unfortunately, that probably made him morph target

Matthew: 20:43

hugely. So yeah, absolutely. And he'd been arrested previously for like, breaking, entering burglary, stuff like that. So he ends up getting put on trial. And he had previously been in a mental hospital, where he had made claims of gaining power through the drinking of blood, and stuff like that. And then they'd said that he has like some kind of audio, visual delusion, kind of like, possible borderline schizophrenia kind of thing. But he does kind of have this air of superiority all the time. Not in like, he seems like a perfectly fine person. But he kind of always looks like, even when he was like, 1617, whenever this happened, he kind of holds himself in a way that he always looks like he's posing for an album cover. You know, like, he always looks like I know, you mean to cool. But when he's on when he's on, when he's on the stand, he does seem kind of distant when they're asking him questions. And according to the if you watch his his testimony, he does kind of paint himself into a couple of corners throughout his testimony. Long story short. The two of them are found guilty. James Baldwin gets life. And Ackles is given the death penalty. No way. Yeah. So Wow. Yeah. So pretty. Pretty unlucky being that they have nothing. Yeah, nothing. Yeah. And they can't use the confession that Miss Kelly gave in order to bring it up in court. That's super harsh. Yeah. So they ended up getting this penalty. So let's fast forward a few years, that the 1990 96 happens with the tooth and stuff and they're trying to get appeals are trying to get a retrial, all this stuff. There is some issues with also, during the initial trial that there was that there was there was some an issue with the jury foreman, kind of leading the judge and the judge and him having kind of like a little bit off colored conversation about the the outcome of whatever the jury says. So it just it was it was a little bit of an exchange about, you know, what, what what happens, what happens? The judge said something about them having to go get lunch before the reading of the sentence, or something like that, which that implies that the judge is expecting a lunch after a meeting and he said, You guys should go get lunch tell the jury to go get lunch before the reading of the sentence. Okay, which implies that he is going to be sentencing them Yeah. Without without actually having the jury tell them if they're Yeah, yeah.

Marissa: 23:49

So yeah, so I've had some insights show it shows a bias. Yeah, nothing else.

Matthew: 23:53

So that's unusual. And that was never reported. This. I don't know. I don't know exactly. How, how trustworthy that is. I didn't, I found it in a spot. But there was also the handling of the evidence there was when the when the bodies were found, they were immediately pulled out of the water their bikes because they had been riding bikes. Their bikes were found on a bank near near the near the river. But they had been they've been pulled out as well in place there. So the police had gone in there and tampered with the whole site before the coroner ever got there. So the coroner gets there, and everything's been trampled on and all this stuff is all you know, all over the place. And there's it just the whole crime scene was just immediately just destroyed before the coroner ever got there. Now, so obviously all the evidence has been kind of I don't want to say tampered with but not handled properly. Again to small force. I don't really know exactly what to do the find a body, get the body you know, so So a bunch of stuff just wasn't wasn't really falling into place quite properly there. And then the and then there was in 2007. So now we're jumping a bit far ahead. There were there was extra DNA testing that was available in 2007, where they were able to pull some DNA evidence from the crime scene, including a hair that was from David Jacoby. Terry Hobbs, his friend that he was playing guitar with. Now, David Jacoby says it makes sense that his hair would be found there because he did go out and do this for the search party. After Terry had left. Terry never showed up. David apparently did. And he said he was searching in that area. So it makes sense that his hair up one of his hairs may have been blown and blown by the wind down to the creek and on to the bodies.

Marissa: 26:10

But he wasn't searching close enough to where he found the bodies. Yeah.

Matthew: 26:13

And it was only his hair. It was only only nobody else was possible suspect nudes hair was was was blown over there. Also, there was possible DNA evidence of Terry on the shoelaces of Now Terry Terry Hobbs is the stepfather of Stevie branch. The shoe laces that had Terry's DNA on it were tied around the ankles and wrists of Christopher Byers. Terry says, Well, that's because it could happen to anybody, because they all hung out together. They'd been at my house, they'd been every so it would only make sense that my DNA can end up on somebody's clothing, or shoes or whatever. Also pretty loose. If you watch the initial the initial behaviors of everyone in the community, they are like, these, these three teens that are like they're guilty as all all heck, by 2007 2011 or two thought Yeah, 2007 2010. Mark Byers, the guy who had the knife that had his DNA on it, he he goes from in the documentary having guns and the other dads are like taking guns and shooting like pumpkins and saying the names of the of the of like Damien Echols and stuff, like so they're like, they're like, pretending to murder these these these teams and toxic masculinity. Yeah, so they're sitting there and they're like, Oh, here's one for what do you call it away? And they're all like shooting like shooting these pumpkins. And it's all right. But then by 2007 through 2010, like they had changed, like Mark Byers becomes a very, very vocal person about these teams did not do it. Like they didn't do it. You have the wrong people. This is this is not justice. You we need to get them out of there and find the real people who did this. And all this made him change his mind. Probably the evidence of well, he he straight up and you can find this too. He straight up is like it was Terry Hobbs. That's who did it. It was Terry Hobbs. That's he just looks right down at the camera. And they're like, Who do you think did it and he's and before the guy even can finish the sentence. He's like it was Terry Hobbs. He's like, if I didn't make that clear enough for you. I don't know what else to tell you. It was Terry Hobbs.

Marissa: 28:51

Well, I'm glad that he was able to move past the he knows the the teenagers. And and, you know, again, I said toxic masculinity and it is in a way that they deal with their feelings that way, but like that, was their pain, also. Sure. You know, they were they didn't know how to take it out.

Matthew: 29:11

To be fair on that to the there were the mothers were saying similar things that if they didn't get found guilty, that if they were ever found on the street, that they would go and they would kill themselves? Absolutely. And you know, and there was actually this kind of a kind of a nice moment with I think it was I think it was Michael Moore's mother in the documentary, where she's saying stuff like that. And her father is like, you can't think like that he was like, because when you think that kind of vengeance and you hold that much hatred in your heart, it makes it so that you're you run the risk of not being able to go to heaven. If you were to do something like that. It would make us He didn't go to heaven, and I'm confident that he's in heaven, and I'm going to see him Again, because I'm going to forgive and release this so that I can go and see him again, you need to do the same. So it's kind of like the sweet touching a little moment in there that's kind of shared there. But, so but he becomes very vocal was it then it's got to be tearing. And in, I believe there's that, well, I know that oxygen release a documentary, or is in the works of a documentary. There's clips of it that are available that are called the Forgotten West Memphis Three, and the Forgotten West Memphis, three are the actual children, that, and I'll kind of touch on that in a second too. But the guy who's investigating this further, he's going around and he's caught, he's trying to like, interview people who, you know, were part of this whole thing. And he interviews David Jacoby, who is clearly nervous as anything like shaking, and this is in like, 2019, right? And he's like, shaking, and he's like, tapping his feet. And he's messing with his, like cigarettes and all this stuff. And he's just like super fidgety. And he can what sticks to me, as he keeps saying, like, he's like crying and stuff, too. And it's like, it's so weird, because even the parents aren't quite, quite as as broken up about it as he seems to be. And again, I don't know, I don't know, what if he, what his what his life was like. So I don't know if he I don't know nothing about this guy. But something that really stuck out to me is he keeps saying, what did they see that would make it so that somebody would do this to them? What did they see? Which is an unusual thing to just draw a conclusion, like, for? I don't think that most murders happen because somebody sees something. Most murders happen, either because of some kind of personal thing, or as a random act of violence, but it's an attack of opportunity, kind of a thing. What did they want heat? Because he was saying stuff like, what did they walk up on? That would lead someone to do this to them? You know, so he's implying that they saw something they weren't supposed to see? Which is weird, in my opinion,

Marissa: 32:15

is quite strange.

Matthew: 32:17

It's very unusual. It just seems it seems to have some, it seems to have a bit of

Marissa: 32:25

why you think he takes off?

Matthew: 32:29

It seems it seems to me that he knows that they saw something. That's what I mean. Yeah. He knows that they saw something that if he knows that they saw something. He knows what they saw. Or at least he knows. Yeah. And that very much points to a much, much better idea as to where his hair had come from. Right. So 2007 new DNA evidence comes comes up. Another thing that was found in the same kind of time, was that Terry Hobbs also had Stevie's pocket knife. Now, Stevie was a very proud boy scout or Cub Scout. He, at the time of his death, he was wearing his Cub Scout uniforms are very, very proud. He's wearing his little so you would treasure that pocket knife. Yeah, he never He was never anywhere without it. And he was very proud of being a scout and stuff. That's why he wore when he wasn't even at a little the meetings and stuff like that. But Terry had Stevie's pocket knife, which seems a bit unusual. So that's another thing that points towards Terry also, possibly. And I'm not trying to say he did it. Because as far as the case goes, those three teenagers they did it found guilty. End of story. This other set well, this story doesn't sit well with some pretty big name music celebrities. So the Dixie Chicks. Eddie Vetter, from Pearl Jam. Just a number of like celebrity musicians start to like come to their aid and start trying to drum up attention the attention Yeah, so they're so they're they're trying to drum up some attention to focus on this some support for this. They're trying to help fund new research and new DNA testing and all this stuff. August 19 2011, Eccles, Baldwin and Miss Kelly, except something called the Alford plea.

Marissa: 34:33

What does that mean?

Matthew: 34:34

So an AR so the the Alford plea is a plea that allows you to claim innocence, with the recognition that the prosecution has enough evidence that if there was a retrial they would be able to convict you which is is kind of unusual, right? So it's

Marissa: 35:02

unusual, as you said, I don't have enough evidence, but I don't

Matthew: 35:05

have enough evidence. Yeah. But this retrial or this, this, this plea, if they accept it will allow them to have their sentence reduced to 18 years and 78 days, which is the amount of time that they had been in prison at the time of this offer. So basically, you accept this plea deal, you get to go out, you get you get to leave. And James Baldwin is was very against this idea. He was like, No, retry, let's go to retry go to retry. He ultimately accepted it, because Damien, is on death row. Oh, yeah. So they could go to it's an opportunity to save him from a possible death sentence. And it's his best friend. So he ultimately takes it and basically saves as saved his friend's life, that all three of them are released, they are still considered guilty of the crime. And because of this, after new DNA evidence, or new DNA technology is now available, they cannot get anyone to test it and bring it to trial. Because judges are stating that because they're free, they can't actually claim like habeas corpus or anything like that. So that they don't, they're not going to continue to keep bringing new evidence in here, because it's basically Case Closed. So most people would agree, though, that there wasn't enough evidence to link them to to it. So if it did go to go to a retrial, they probably would have been, they probably it probably would have been found not guilty.

Marissa: 36:59

Yeah, but I guess if you know, time is a factor if you're on death row. So

Matthew: 37:03

yeah, I don't know exactly how that was all going. Going down. But it also just like it, why take that chance, if you can save your your friend's life, right. So it was it was it was cool that they that they did that. So they are all free at this point in time, effectively, and they're still fighting for this and they're still trying to bring this stuff. But the but the the judges, the judge isn't the they're not willing to retry any new DNA because as far as as far as the case is concerned, it's over there. They're guilty. They admitted it. And in doing so, with the acceptance of the Alford plea and their release, they also agree that they can't sue the state of Arkansas, for wrongful imprisonment, right. So they get out of jail. But it I mean, even bringing the Alford plea to the table. To me, I kind of feel like Arkansas. Y'all know, y'all know you did this? Yeah. You know, and you're just the now you're trying to like, but you're trying to save your own ass at that point. Right. So these guys are there they are. Particularly, as far as I think, from what I can find on like, on a quick search for these guys. James Baldwin is still like, heavily involved as like a director of proclaim justice.org which tries to free or exonerate is that the right word? People who are wrongfully imprisoned and so he's part of that program as well. And then Jesse Miss Kelly was, like, went to a community college to become a mechanic or something along those lines. And Damien Echols has, kind of, you know, palled around with with with some of those celebrities, and depending on when you listen to this September of 2022, he's hosting a ritual release a retreat in California, where you can join him and a writing partner to learn about magical rituals and inner consciousness and energy projection. So he's still firmly in in that lineup. Super cool. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, so they're out. They're still upset about it. And there's doesn't really seem like they're really gonna get a whole lot of closure on this. It's still obviously heavy and hangs, hangs over. They're alive and they're definitely very much identified by that. But yeah, you can check out the Paradise Lost series on HBO. Still, the oxygen, the Forgotten West Memphis Three. The reason they're forgotten is because it's pretty much it's pretty much known that their killers are out there like, you know, and it's not the it's not the quote unquote West methods three the teams. These guys they're not getting any justice and neither are the West Memphis Three because they're they're also preventing them from getting the justice because they're effectively taking the drop for taking the fall for it, you know,

Marissa: 40:32

intentionally but yeah,

Matthew: 40:35

I'm not saying like, you know, there's

Marissa: 40:38

it's just so sad I mean the detail of that the boy with his little boy scout jacket on because he was so proud of it like that's just

Matthew: 40:45

yeah, and there's a lot more to this to the story as well I do. Highly recommend that, that that you guys if anybody's out there who's interested in this, go look at some of these other other sources because it's it's really It's fascinating how how mishandled this whole situation was just as a kind of an update. The John Mark Byers, the father of CRISPR virus, he he died in 2020 in a car accident at the age of 63. And Melissa Byers, the mother of Christopher virus, she died under somewhat suspicious circumstances, the cause of death was most likely a possible drug overdose. Back in 1996. Mark Byers was there, even though that they had been kind of going through some issues. He had, she had moved back in with her parents and he believe it was she moved back in with her parents. And he showed up at one point, and during his stay there she she expired. And yeah, that was only three years after, after the death of her of her son. As far as like I said, with David Jacoby, he, he's he someone that a lot of the other people are in the more recent documentaries as well. So those they can kind of they have kind of their own updates for that. So you can go see those if you wish. And now we should have our theme music plan to bring us in to Marisa is McCobb mana.

Marissa: 42:48

Yes. So today's McCobb minute takes us to Canada.

Matthew: 42:54

We're very McCobb place.

Marissa: 42:57

Drinking fast or drink it's slow but the lips have got to touch the toe. 1973 a former cowboy named Nick Stephenson found a jar in a cabin on the outskirts of Dawson City Yukon. inside the jar was alcohol and a human toe preserved within it. Stevenson took it to the downtown hotel where patrons can drink out of the pickled toe jar. If you do you get a certificate to a membership to the sour toe cocktail Club, which actually has approximately 9500 members.

Matthew: 43:28

So not very exclusive. Not super fun. You

Marissa: 43:30

know, the same toe is always used well for a while. Although it has had to be replaced a few times after accidentally being swallowed.

Matthew: 43:40

Yeah, how where are they getting all their toes?

Marissa: 43:43

Okay, so the replacement toes are willingly donated after being lost to inoperable corns frostbite a myriad of reasons for losing your toes

Matthew: 43:54

and operable corns keep your certificate that's Yep. And operable.

Marissa: 44:02

Yep. Seems like they must be followed swallowed pretty frequently because the first toe was swallowed in 1980 and the second one was not lot was swallowed Not long afterward. The third toe was swallowed in 1983 on a toes in quick succession here. It is a$2,500 fine if you swallow the toe. Oh, wow.

Matthew: 44:23

Yeah. enforced by who? The toe police? Yeah, I mean, come on toes.

Marissa: 44:30

I'm sure it's very various toes because it could happen to any of your toes and limb I happen to

Matthew: 44:36

swallow and a big toe Abby grow. That's that is a tough thing to do.

Marissa: 44:41

Now. The most recent toe was donated with a message that said to not wear open toed sandals while mowing the lawn. It's good advice. The cocktail recipe is one ounce minimum of alcohol one dehydrated toe and garnish for courage. Notice garnish with courage I'm sorry. So basically just alcohol and tau.

Matthew: 45:04

Yeah, absolutely. So that's that's how that's how I'm toes. I'm supposed to be taken straight.

Marissa: 45:10

That's not the the club has acquired over 25 toes since it's been doing this all donated. But yeah,

Matthew: 45:18

I mean, I guess I mean, if you have me probably have a pool of certificate holders that are willing to give their toes for it.

Marissa: 45:26

Yeah. I mean, if somebody has been there, and they're aware of it, and then they have to lose their toe. They're like, You know what I could do with that.

Matthew: 45:30

All right. No, okay. Here's the thing. How were they going to get their toes removed?

Marissa: 45:36

That they get to keep their toes? Yeah, most places won't let you keep

Matthew: 45:38

your body part can keep shit when I get stuff. Yeah, I don't know. Not that I have a ton of stuff that I've ever had taken out of my body. I did get to keep a massive Splinter that went into my thigh. When I was in the body part when I was little. Yeah. Yeah, I had a slip underneath my cousin's bed. While we were like playing and he had like hardwood floors. So you could slide really well. Yeah. And, and I almost always exclusively wore sweatpants, just like a sweat suit. So I went running into the room and went to slide under the bed and I slid, and my probably 200 pound plus young body slid over a splinter in the wood on the floor and was about three, probably about three inches of wood through my thigh. Wow, that was pretty rough. Yikes. I got brought to the hospital. And I had I don't know if you've ever played the the board game mousetrap. And then that when it gets kind of what's it called? The the type of machine?

Marissa: 46:41

Oh, I don't know, if you asked me I wouldn't know.

Matthew: 46:44

Whatever someone were, it's the, you know, I keep thinking Rorschach tests, but it's not started with a G I think anyways, it it's the thing where you know, you have a little you drop a marble and then that hits hits a bell and this happens at the end result. Is this the Goldberg Rube Goldberg. That's it Goldberg this. G. So the little net that falls elastic cap that falls on the mouse was used to hold my sweat pants up over the wound. I was I got brought to the hospital ingenuity. Yeah. Thanks, dad. But yeah, and then that was that was fun, too, because they'd numbed it up and I got to watch the doctor try to tear it out of my skin with just a pair of like medical pliers, I guess. And he didn't want to have to actually like cut it out. So he just tried to pull it out and pulled it and it snapped and go in again and pull it out. And I don't recall ever feeling anything from it after the initial stab, stab Aroo. But yeah, I got to keep that in a little urine sample. Jar. And then I think I left it at my cousin's house. I don't throw it away at some point. I feel like there was other bits and pieces of my body that I tried to keep. And I wasn't able to.

Marissa: 48:01

I was gonna ask if I keep an ID once, but then I was like an athlete. So I didn't.

Matthew: 48:06

Why? Weird? Well, it's weird. But I shouldn't be like, we only have

Marissa: 48:11

one or two. I would have asked anyway. But I didn't really care that much.

Matthew: 48:15

It was a thought well, the missed opportunity. Yeah. Well, that will do it for us this week for this entry. If you would like to reach out, feel free to do so you can reach us on Twitter, and Facebook at Macabrepedia.

Marissa: 48:31

Also on Instagram at Macabrepediapod and email and macabrepediapod@gmail.com.

Matthew: 48:37

And thank you to all of our patrons over on Patreon. If you like what we do here, you can support us over there it is$5 It is the you can you can give whatever you like but $5 will get you a couple of extra episodes. And a couple little little tidbits. If you like if you'd like bitten your kids, that's where you can do it over there on Patreon. And you can check us out over there. And that also gives us access it gives you access to discord, which occasionally has a few unusual conversations about you know, wrestling and murderers and people named magics. And percentage wise it's mostly mostly people with the nickname of magic, but thank you as always, and join us next week as we add another entry into this our Macabrepedia

Macabrepedia: A Marriage of True Crime and the Truly Bizarre

The West Memphis Three (Satanic Panic IV)

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